Stegosaurid from Oxfordshire

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Peter.Agricola
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Stegosaurid from Oxfordshire

Post autor: Peter.Agricola »

hallo my name is Peter and some of you guys already know me, especially you David and Daniel. this is my first time on this forum, and I am very glad that I can join it. few months ago I found near Oxford in a quarry called Woodeaton quarry remains of a stegosaurid dinosaur, which is probably a new genus of a dinosaur. unfortunatelly I didn't found any diagnostic material so it will be quite hard to describe this animal. the material includes an ilium, some ribs, few dorsal osteodermal plates, and a process of a probably dorsal neural arch. if is somebody interested I can send some pictures on e-mails of the bones and fossilsite. please let me know on my e-mail adress - paleo23@gmail.com or here at the forum.

and one more thing, I was for two times in Krasiejow but I don't remember any Polish, so please, write to me in English. thank you.
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Post autor: Dino »

Na prośbę Marcina zamieszczam tłumaczenie:
Witam, nazywam się Peter i część Waszych kolegów zna mnie, zwłaszcza ty, Dawidzie [Mazurku :)] i Danielu [Madzia :D]. To jest moja pierwsza wizyta na tym forum, i jestem bardzo zadowolony, że mogłem się do niego dołączyć. Kilka miesięcy temu, znalazłem w pobliżu Oksforfu w kopalni zwanej Woodeaton kopalne szczątki stegozaurydowego dinozaura, które należą pradopodobnie do nowego gatunku. Nieszczęśliwie, nie znalazłem żadnego diagnostycznego materiału, więc będzie ciężko opisać to zwierzę. Materiał zawiera: kość biodrową, kilka osteoderm grzbietowych, oraz wyrostek prawdopodobnie łuku kręgowego. Jeśli ktoś jest zainteresowany, mogę przesłać kilka zdjęć skamieniałości i miejsca znalezienia na e-mail. Proszę dać mi znać na mój adres - paleo23@gmail.com, bądź tutaj, na forum.

I jeszcze jedna sprawa - byłem dwa razy w Krasiejowie, ale nie pamiętam polskiego, więc proszę, piszcie do mnie po angielsku, dziękuję.

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Daniel Madzia
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Re: Stegosaurid from Oxfordshire

Post autor: Daniel Madzia »

Prosciej bedzie po angielsku...
Peter.Agricola pisze:few months ago I found near Oxford in a quarry called Woodeaton quarry remains of a stegosaurid dinosaur, which is probably a new genus of a dinosaur. unfortunatelly I didn't found any diagnostic material so it will be quite hard to describe this animal. the material includes an ilium, some ribs, few dorsal osteodermal plates, and[...]
Peter, please, be careful with your classification. ;) It's difficult to say whether the animal is a stegosaurid. It's a thyreophoran but we aren't sure about its position among "armored dinosaurs". As I already wrote you, it's horribly preserved and highly incomplete. Moreover, we can't be sure (well, I can't be sure, because I haven't seen it personally) whether your "stegosaurid" isn't chimaera. You've found many indeterminable fragments from different places (or am I wrong?).
Peter.Agricola pisze:a process of a probably dorsal neural arch.
I would even say (based on the picture you've sent me) that this process is incomplete spinous process of a dorsal vertebra. But again - I'd like to see it from different sides and under higher resolution... Personal examination would be the best though.

Peter, give me one complete dorsal vertebra and I will tell you if it is a stegosaur :P Okey, I'm joking, but something like that would be pretty good.

Finally, it possibly is a new genus and species of thyreophoran dinosaur, but I can't tell you more till I see it...
Peter.Agricola pisze:and one more thing, I was for two times in Krasiejow but I don't remember any Polish, so please, write to me in English. thank you.
Heh! Ale ciagle wszystko wszedzie "szuka". :P

Peter.Agricola
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Post autor: Peter.Agricola »

ok, but the osteodermal plates are typical for a stegosarian and, about the process, you know, that I will show you all bones this summer, if we don't meet in Krasiejow, you can come to Slovakia, or I can come tu Trinec. we will see. so we have to mannage a meeting.
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Post autor: Daniel Madzia »

Peter.Agricola pisze:ok, but the osteodermal plates are typical for a stegosarian
Generally, "dermal armour" (i.e. plates or spines, and scutes [series of pyramidal scutes are present in Scelidosaurus and ankylosaurs]) is synapomorphy of Thyreophora. But yes, plates and/or spines are synapomorphy of Stegosauria, which doesn't mean that your dino is a stegosaurid. ;)

But again - we are not sure (well, well, well... I'm not sure...) that the dermal armour you've found are typical "plates". The pictures are not convincing. ;)
Peter.Agricola pisze:and, about the process, you know, that I will show you all bones this summer
I hope so.

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Post autor: Peter.Agricola »

yes, but I saw the plates for so many times, that I don't have any doubts that I am right. and especially Susannah Maidment, Angela Milner and Dave Martill suggested that they are stegosaurian. Don't worry, now we know, that we will meet in Krasiejow, so I will bring the bones there.
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Daniel Madzia
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Post autor: Daniel Madzia »

Peter.Agricola pisze:yes, but I saw the plates for so many times
Then you are much more competent than me. ;)
Peter.Agricola pisze:that I don't have any doubts that I am right. and especially Susannah Maidment, Angela Milner and Dave Martill suggested that they are stegosaurian.
"Stegosaurian" is not the same as "stegosaurid". The former is member of Stegosauria, and the latter is member of Stegosauridae. If the dino is closer to Stegosaurus than to Ankylosaurus, then it is member of Stegosauria. If it is closer do Stegosaurus than to Huayangosaurus, it is a stegosaurid. If it isn't descendent of most recent common ancestor of Stegosaurus and Huayangosaurus, then it is non-stegosaurid non-huayangosaurid stegosaur[ian]. ;)

Of course, if they suggested that you have a stegosaur (or stegosaurian - both are correct), it doesn't mean that it isn't a stegosaurid.
Peter.Agricola pisze:Don't worry, now we know, that we will meet in Krasiejow, so I will bring the bones there.
;)

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